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Go Back   Talk Budgies Forums > Budgie Talk > Budgie Breeding > Mutations and Genetics


Mutations and Genetics Learn about budgie genetics and the wide variety of mutations.

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  #1  
Old 11-23-2014, 08:33 AM
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Default Theory about Crystal's Mutation

Okay so for a while I've been confused about Crystal. She's too light to be lutino and too dark to be a normal creamino. Well so far her outcomes are a Skyblue YFII Greywing, Skyblue Clearwing, An apparent green series greywing, and a normal green. So from that I don't understand how one baby can be YFII but the rest aren't if she were a YF II Creamino. I can only assume that her mutation is a bit more complex than that.

At this point I think that she's a dilute ino split for blue and YFII and Charming is a visual skyblue clearwing.

Would I be correct in her mutation based on the outcomes of the chicks so far? I've been very surprised about how they're all feathering out.

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Old 11-23-2014, 10:32 AM
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Can we have pictures of the parents and chicks please? That will be a big help as it is hard to say without them. Make sure to use natural lighting with no flash with the mutations mentioned if at all possible To answer your questions so far though:

To get a normal chick she can't be a dilute paired to a clearwing. You would get all clearwings with that pairing.

If she is a sf yellowface II you would expect yellowface and non- yellowface chicks. Only df yellowface II would have all sf yellowface II chicks.

If she has any green chicks, she is indeed a lutino rather than creamino if dad is a blue.

Again though, pictures often answer questions the best. There are a lot of "if's" without them

Last edited by CuteLittleBirdies; 11-23-2014 at 10:50 AM. Reason: Adding info
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:06 AM
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Sure thing! Thanks Lindsey. The normal green chick is the yellow and could have been fathered by a yellow green cock so that might explain it? It hasn't feathered out any green yet so I'm not sure. But there is a YFII chick for sure and the clearwing is clearly skyblue. The 4th is too young to tell what it's going to feather out to be. He's in the middle of the group shot.

Crystal has bright red eyes but it appears black in some pictures. Dad's patch is blurry but is a dark non diluted blue.

Theory about Crystal's Mutation-chick-5.jpg

Theory about Crystal's Mutation-chick.jpg

Theory about Crystal's Mutation-chick-2.jpg

Theory about Crystal's Mutation-chick-3.jpg

Theory about Crystal's Mutation-chick-4.jpg

Last edited by BumbleBee; 11-23-2014 at 11:22 AM.
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:15 AM
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From these, I don't think you have any green series chicks The appearance of both crystal and the chicks indicate that she is a sf goldenface creamino, and the chicks are likewise sf goldenfaces: Goldenface (Single Factor) Budgies - ************* Cute Little Birdies Aviary
Here is a example of a sf goldenface, df spangle to show how the yellow can spread on a all white bird to give you a better idea: Spangle (Double Factor) Budgies - ************* Cute Little Birdies Aviary

In addition to what you mentioned, you also have at least 1 little pied there as well. Momma could be masking any of them, so time will tell which
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:27 AM
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A pied? Really? Could it be Breeze's I did foster some of her chicks to Crystal but all of these ones look like a diluted type so I thought these were all hers.

Thank you so much!!! I'm so excited about them. They are a complete surprise.
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:40 AM
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Sorry, I didn't see your edited post

Ok here is the thing and bear with me on it..... It is impossible for a budgie to have 3 copies of any given green, yellowface or blue gene. They can only have two

So with that being said if she has a blue mate it is impossible for crystal to have green, yellowface AND normal blue chicks as she would need 3 different genes to do that.

If she was a lutino split for yellowface, she would have greens and yellowface blues.
If she was a sf yellowface or goldenface she would have yellowface blues and non-yellowface blues.

Now.... If there is another dad involved that changes everything of course. I thought dad was actually dad as you didn't mention it initially
In that case if the yellow is darker than it appears on my screen and it is a green chick....one of the chicks that would have been blue or goldenface from your pair got a green gene from the guy on the side is he a pied by chance as well? If so, the pied might have come from him and not crystal.

Regardless though, I still am sticking with what I said originally about Crystals mutation. She looks too dark to be a sf yellowface II to me in that pic if it is true to life, and the chicks are pretty dark for sf yellowface II as well

I can not see enough of the male to tell anything about his mutation other than he is a blue and some sort of dilution. If you can post a clear one of him from the front and behind that would help.
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:43 AM
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Also where does the dilution come from in Crystal? She would have to be split for something at least to have the clearwing and greywing babies. I say greywings since they're much darker than the white looking one.Could they all be clearwing? Which would make her clearwing as well or would she still carry the dilute gene?
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BumbleBee View Post
A pied? Really? Could it be Breeze's I did foster some of her chicks to Crystal but all of these ones look like a diluted type so I thought these were all hers.

Thank you so much!!! I'm so excited about them. They are a complete surprise.
Oh gosh, you are killing me here Mary!!

If there are this many options for parents it is just a guessing game as to who came from whom unless each pair have really distinct mutations

What are breeze and her mate? If you fostered and are not sure who is who then it is mostly a guessing game, and the chick outcomes really can't be relied on in determining what crystal and her mate are
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:51 AM
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Well I know for certain he is a skyblue clearwing. He has no other visual mutations other than that.

The male that she was with a week before she laid the first egg was a light green greywing though I am thinking he might be dilute himself. I had a whole other thread about him and my confusion about him as well. They didn't seem to get along so I switched her to Charming and so I thought since it was a week since I moved her until she laid the first egg that they would all be his. None of them, including the possible dad of the other chick, are visually pied. The only visually pied is Blizzard and he was never with Crystal.

I'm also confused because the dark yellow one is younger than the oldest, the clearwing skyblue. But now that I think of it the yellow might be from the green pied pair I fostered 2 eggs into since the mom was destroying the eggs? I marked them when I put them in and I thought they were infertile... I think I messed this one up too much... it's like a jigsaw puzzle!!!
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Old 11-23-2014, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CuteLittleBirdies View Post


Oh gosh, you are killing me here Mary!!

If there are this many options for parents it is just a guessing game as to who came from whom unless each pair have really distinct mutations

What are breeze and her mate? If you fostered and are not sure who is who then it is mostly a guessing game, and the chick outcomes really can't be relied on in determining what crystal and her mate are
I thought I knew which ones were theres because they have dark factored blues that are normal and pieds. I know the dark yellow one isn't Breeze and Blizzards baby as they are both blue with no YF factors.
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