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Go Back   Talk Budgies Forums > Budgie Talk > Budgie Breeding > Mutations and Genetics


Mutations and Genetics Learn about budgie genetics and the wide variety of mutations.
Thread Description:and clarifications

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  #1  
Old 12-30-2008, 11:45 PM
 
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Default A Few Questions

Hi everyone I have a couple of questions that I'm a little blurred on...

1. Well, all along I thought that Milo was a YF2 Dilute Sky Blue.. but now I'm starting to wonder if he is actually a Greywing?



2. What are the differences between a Dilute and a Greywing? I know that Greywings can dilute the body color as well, so what are the key differences to look for? Do the cheek feathers make a difference at all? (Dilute: sky blue cheek feathers, Greywing: dark blue cheek feathers?)

3. If a Normal Sky Blue budgies has every characteristic of a Normal mutation (full colored wings, no band), but has a tiny, tiny small patch on the back of his head, is he still a Normal or a Pied?

4. If a Light Green Dominant Pied is all yellow with Pied wing markings and a band across the stomach, but has clear, white flight feathers, is he a Dominant Pied or a Clearflight? Can clearflights have bands on the stomach?

5. Last Question.... How on earth do you make up the mutation line?? I know the Yellow Face factor comes first, but after that, I always seem to mix it up to what other people say..

Is it, for exmaple, YF2 Opaline Sky Blue Pied?
Or YF2 Sky Blue Opaline Pied?
Or YF2 Recessive Pied Opaline Blue?

Thanks in advanced!

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  #2  
Old 12-31-2008, 12:39 AM
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I believe milo is a yellow face type 1 Sky blue Grey wing The reason i say yellow face type 1 is because the yellow is only on his head and is very pale. Most type 2's have yellow going through the wings as well

Grey wings have grey wing markings and head markings instead of the normal black

and they are only 50% diluted on body color

A Dilution is 80% body color diluted & the head and wing markings are very light

#3 - if a "normal" budgies has the pied "marking" on the back of the head but no other "pied markings" it is split to recessive pied (budgies can't be split to dominate pied as far as i know because it is dominate and over takes other mutations)

#4 i don't know the answer to that one lol

#5 Honestly I don't think it matters, I've said it many different ways and i haven't always put yellow face 1st - i guess its how ever it pops in my head is how it comes out
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Old 12-31-2008, 01:01 AM
 
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Thanks ATV!

Hmm, actually, Milo does have yellow splotches going down his wings. It may not be clear in that photo but the yellow is there. Maybe this picture will help:



I thought so, he does look like a Greywing to me too.
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  #4  
Old 12-31-2008, 01:06 AM
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I'm not sure if that would still be considered yellow face type 2 or not - Its so much easier to tell it on older birds

But here's Hope when she was just a few months old, the white parts of her wings look stained up but its actually yellow from being yellow face type 2 (it was there from they time she feathered out lol)

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Old 12-31-2008, 01:18 AM
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I think you'd have to wait 'till hes older to see if he's type one or two or not lol.

ATV answered the other questions, so Ill see if I can answer #4

Quote:
4. If a Light Green Dominant Pied is all yellow with Pied wing markings and a band across the stomach, but has clear, white flight feathers, is he a Dominant Pied or a Clearflight? Can clearflights have bands on the stomach?
Dominant Pied (a lot of pieds have clear flights). and no, clearflights can't have the bands on the stomach
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Old 12-31-2008, 01:20 AM
 
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Thanks! Milo is still pretty young, so hopefully the future will tell
Thank you for clearing up the clearflights!
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Old 12-31-2008, 01:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post
Thanks! Milo is still pretty young, so hopefully the future will tell
Thank you for clearing up the clearflights!
no problem Ive been breeding the clearflights for a few years now and none of the clearflights Ive ever seen have ever had the bands lol. The bands are indicators of Dominant Pied anyway lol
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Old 12-31-2008, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post

2. What are the differences between a Dilute and a Greywing?
Dilution
In addition to a dark factor, budgies may also have a degree of dilution. There are four types of dilution: greywing, full-body-color greywing, clearwing, and dilute. Greywing budgies have grey markings on head and wings instead of black, and the body feather color is about 50% diluted (washed out). Full-body-color greywing budgies have the same grey markings of the greywing but the body color is brightened (not lightened or diluted). Clearwing budgies have very light or no markings on head and wings and the body color is brightened (not lightened or diluted). Dilute budgies are washed out all over. The head and wing markings are very light, and the body color is about 80% diluted (washed out). Without any dilution, the budgie looks like the normal budgies seen above.
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Old 12-31-2008, 08:25 PM
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These questions have been fairly well answered but I'll answer anyway
Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post
1. Well, all along I thought that Milo was a YF2 Dilute Sky Blue.. but now I'm starting to wonder if he is actually a Greywing?
Yes I'd say he was a greywing
Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post
2. What are the differences between a Dilute and a Greywing? I know that Greywings can dilute the body color as well, so what are the key differences to look for? Do the cheek feathers make a difference at all? (Dilute: sky blue cheek feathers, Greywing: dark blue cheek feathers?)
Greywing can dilute the body colour up to 50%. Dilute will dilute the body colour 80% or more. The colour of the cheek patches depends on the base body colour
Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post
3. If a Normal Sky Blue budgies has every characteristic of a Normal mutation (full colored wings, no band), but has a tiny, tiny small patch on the back of his head, is he still a Normal or a Pied?
It is a normal and the patch usually means that it split for recessive pied. Not all birds that are split for recessive pied have this patch
Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post
4. If a Light Green Dominant Pied is all yellow with Pied wing markings and a band across the stomach, but has clear, white flight feathers, is he a Dominant Pied or a Clearflight? Can clearflights have bands on the stomach?
It is a dominant pied. Clearflight pieds can have some clear areas on their fronts but it is usually mottled and located high on the chest area. The amount of clear area is a lot more variable on a clearflight pied than on a dominant pied. The other thing to remember when indentifying pieds is that it is possible for a bird to be a combination of more than one pied mutation
Quote:
Originally Posted by softie View Post
5. Last Question.... How on earth do you make up the mutation line?? I know the Yellow Face factor comes first, but after that, I always seem to mix it up to what other people say..

Is it, for exmaple, YF2 Opaline Sky Blue Pied?
Or YF2 Sky Blue Opaline Pied?
Or YF2 Recessive Pied Opaline Blue?
Some associations have preferences for the order that the mutations are written. Some Australian clubs always put the colour first and the mutation last. English clubs seem to mostly use the other way round. If birds are being shown it would depend which class they were entered in. For example if a recessive pied spangle was entered in the recessive pied class you'd call it a spangle recessive pied. The main thing is to make it clear when using terms like double factor or type 2 is which mutation the term refers to: For example if you called a bird a yellow face spangle grey type 2 double factor it's unclear whether it's the yellow face that is double factor or the spangle or the grey; And what does the type 2 refer to?
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Last edited by nev90; 12-31-2008 at 08:26 PM.
  #10  
Old 12-31-2008, 10:23 PM
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Don't you just love Multi quoting nev??
I think Milo is a greywing but that has already been said lol
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