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Go Back   Talk Budgies Forums > Budgie Talk > Budgie Breeding > Mutations and Genetics


Mutations and Genetics Learn about budgie genetics and the wide variety of mutations.

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Old 09-16-2017, 06:21 AM
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Default whats the mutation of these two?

Hey guys

I would like to know the mutation of these two:

first the female, I hope she is golden face






and this little boy, is he clearwing or fbgw?



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  #2  
Old 09-16-2017, 10:18 AM
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What is the problem with the female's wing?
Has it been injured/broken?
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Old 09-16-2017, 11:33 AM
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Originally Posted by FaeryBee View Post
What is the problem with the female's wing?
Has it been injured/broken?
I was told that she got injured when she was young, she acts normally and can fly though.
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  #4  
Old 09-16-2017, 02:06 PM
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They're both beautiful

Female is sky blue sf goldenface opaline cinnamon, and the little one is FBGW Thank you for sharing their pictures with us!
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Old 09-16-2017, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by StarlingWings View Post
They're both beautiful

Female is sky blue sf goldenface opaline cinnamon, and the little one is FBGW Thank you for sharing their pictures with us!
Thanks, how can you tell a clearwing from fbgw?? I always forget.
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Last edited by FaeryBee; 09-16-2017 at 04:08 PM. Reason: Please do not use endearments when posting.
  #6  
Old 09-16-2017, 03:08 PM
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Clearwings have undiluted violet cheek patches rather than the lighter cheek patches on FBGS and greywings. Additionally, clearwing flight feathers are lighter, it's hard to see from the photo but your little one seems to have grey flights.
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Old 09-16-2017, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by StarlingWings View Post
Clearwings have undiluted violet cheek patches rather than the lighter cheek patches on FBGS and greywings. Additionally, clearwing flight feathers are lighter, it's hard to see from the photo but your little one seems to have grey flights.
Thanks for clarifying, I was hoping the cinnamon female was mauve or Cobalt at least, I thought that the cinnamon has diluted the body color and she is not skyblue, but she is beautiful.

I couldn't find a cinnamon male and all the good cinnamon females her are quite expensive, so I bought her and Im gonna pair her up with a good sized split cinnamon cock, he is pied though and I would like to get normal cinnamon cocks from him, I'll be using them to try breeding lacewings, as they are very rare her.

What would you suggest to do to get lacewings from scratch?

Thanks for the help BTW.
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Old 09-16-2017, 05:41 PM
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I think cobalt is a possibility for the female, it's difficult to tell because of the goldenface suffusion and dilution from the opaline and cinnamon. When you breed her it should shed more light on which one of the two she is depending on how many dark factors the chicks inherit.

For lacewings, I would establish a few good cinnamon lineages, which it sounds like you're doing. Since you don't want to breed two Inos together because of potential genetic problems down the line, I would have at least two unrelated breeding pairs of an Ino with a cinnamon so you have chicks from one clutch that can be bred with chicks of the other clutch when the time comes to prevent inbreeding.

Since you mention you're looking to get cinnamon cocks from the above female and a split male, this is probably the easiest starting off point for lacewings. Breeding a cinnamon cock with an Ino hen will give you all males in the clutch split to both ino and cinnamon and all females visual cinnamon. Breeding the male chicks of one clutch with the female chicks of the other clutch will give you 25% cinnamon males that are split for Ino, 25% males split for cinnamon, 25% normal females, and 25% lacewing females, by my understanding. This is the easiest way to get lacewings.

If you pair an Ino male with a cinnamon female, all female chicks will be Ino and all male chicks will be split for cinnamon and Ino. If you have two lines of this same pairing (i.e Ino x cinnamon unrelated to next pair of Ino x cinnamon) then you can breed the male chicks of one pair with the females of the other (i.e /cinnamon /ino (male) x visual Ino (female)), which would give you 25% Ino males split for cinnamon, 25% males split for Ino, 25% lacewing females, and 25% normal females.

Depending on what you want your cocks to be split for (cinnamon or Ino) and show visually in the end (visually Ino and /cinnamon, or visually cinnamon and /Ino) is the only difference between the two pairings.

These aren't great odds, but that's why lacewings are so difficult to breed as it often takes years to produce lacewing chicks. There are other ways to do this, but this is the way I would definitely recommend because it's the safest and most ethical way to breed lacewings without having issues with inbreeding, genetic problems, etc.

Hope that helps! Best of luck
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Last edited by StarlingWings; 09-16-2017 at 06:01 PM.
  #9  
Old 09-16-2017, 11:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StarlingWings View Post
I think cobalt is a possibility for the female, it's difficult to tell because of the goldenface suffusion and dilution from the opaline and cinnamon. When you breed her it should shed more light on which one of the two she is depending on how many dark factors the chicks inherit.

For lacewings, I would establish a few good cinnamon lineages, which it sounds like you're doing. Since you don't want to breed two Inos together because of potential genetic problems down the line, I would have at least two unrelated breeding pairs of an Ino with a cinnamon so you have chicks from one clutch that can be bred with chicks of the other clutch when the time comes to prevent inbreeding.

Since you mention you're looking to get cinnamon cocks from the above female and a split male, this is probably the easiest starting off point for lacewings. Breeding a cinnamon cock with an Ino hen will give you all males in the clutch split to both ino and cinnamon and all females visual cinnamon. Breeding the male chicks of one clutch with the female chicks of the other clutch will give you 25% cinnamon males that are split for Ino, 25% males split for cinnamon, 25% normal females, and 25% lacewing females, by my understanding. This is the easiest way to get lacewings.

If you pair an Ino male with a cinnamon female, all female chicks will be Ino and all male chicks will be split for cinnamon and Ino. If you have two lines of this same pairing (i.e Ino x cinnamon unrelated to next pair of Ino x cinnamon) then you can breed the male chicks of one pair with the females of the other (i.e /cinnamon /ino (male) x visual Ino (female)), which would give you 25% Ino males split for cinnamon, 25% males split for Ino, 25% lacewing females, and 25% normal females.

Depending on what you want your cocks to be split for (cinnamon or Ino) and show visually in the end (visually Ino and /cinnamon, or visually cinnamon and /Ino) is the only difference between the two pairings.

These aren't great odds, but that's why lacewings are so difficult to breed as it often takes years to produce lacewing chicks. There are other ways to do this, but this is the way I would definitely recommend because it's the safest and most ethical way to breed lacewings without having issues with inbreeding, genetic problems, etc.

Hope that helps! Best of luck
Thank you very much, I really appreciate it.
Am gonna go with the first pairing to get cinnamon cocks to increase my cinnamon stock,

another mutation combination im aiming to have is df golden face reccissive pied cinnamon spangle opaline.

Again thank you very much for your help.
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  #10  
Old 09-17-2017, 12:07 AM
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You're very welcome! I look forward to hearing more about your breeding pairs!
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