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-   -   Color Question (https://www.talkbudgies.com/mutations-genetics/72303-color-question.html)

KTyne 05-28-2011 08:33 PM

Color Question
 
So I know that in Budgie genetics green is dominant over blue, but I was wondering if blue is dominant over other colors such as if you have an all white bird?
Or would it be two recessive traits and hence you'd get a split bunch of colored babies?

Genetics is my favorite subject in Biology, and I'm trying to get a handle on Budgie genetics! (I'm interested in breeding Budgies in maybe a year or two) So far I think I've read every sticky thread in the Breeding section so please don't just tell me to go read those, lol.

Thanks guys!

Corina 05-28-2011 09:24 PM

I'll try and explain it to you, hopefully I make sense. Things usually make perfect sense in my head but I can never get them across through writing or even words :o

So we have two base colors we differentiate them by green series budgies which have a yellow base color and blue series budgies that have a white base color.

Each series has different dark factors which make the different shades you see such as olive green and skyblue. So basically we only have green budgies and blue budgies. Yellow is green and White is blue (don't know if that makes sense?)

So yes, green is dominant over blue. To produce a white bird a mutation that removes color would be needed such as pied, or albino which would work the same way on a green budgie but making it yellow instead of white.

I know you said you read the stickies, but have you read the one in my siggy? the one titled "Basic Color Expectations" I think it made a lot more sense when I wrote it on there! :p

KTyne 05-28-2011 09:32 PM

So what Budgie mutations would you have to breed together to get an all white or mostly white bird? (not necessarily Albino) Also, I don't think I completely understand pieds yet.
If you bred a blue bird with a white bird (non-albino white, can't remember exactly what it was called. Grey blue?) would you get split birds or would there be less blue on the offspring or?
I'm pretty sure I read your sticky but I'll double check to be sure! ^_^

KTyne 05-28-2011 09:32 PM

Sorry, double post.

akane 05-28-2011 09:32 PM

It's not so much blue and green as white and yellow. A blue bird is blue on white and a green bird is blue on yellow to make green. Lots of things can make a "clear" bird which is a bird that only has it's white or yellow base color. I have some dark eyed clears which combine recessive pied and clearflight pied to remove all the color. A double factor spangle is also all clear and then there is an actual albino gene. With the albino gene a solid white bird is called albino and a solid yellow lutino. The eye color and iris ring can tell you which gene or combination is causing you to have an all clear budgie.

Most of these mutations are recessive, except the clearflight pied, so both birds have to carry it. You will get clear birds or not clear birds. The color will not dilute any by mixing. It's just there or not there. In the case of dark eyed clears you could get some pied birds where they have some clear feathers (yellow or white feathers) and the other feathers will be the normal body color. With spangles 1 copy of the gene changes the markings on the bird and 2 copies (double factor) makes them clear. The colored feathers will be the same shade as they would have been without spangle or pied. A different set of genes determines the shade of the color.

KTyne 05-28-2011 09:46 PM

Ahhhh ok, that makes a bit more sense.
And Corina, your sticky makes sense to me for dark factor genes but for some reason my mind can't convert that to make sense with the yellow/white thing, lol.
I think it'd make more sense if there was an example I could see with a punnett square in regards to making a bird have just their base color. :|
I'm definitely a visual learner!

KTyne 05-28-2011 10:07 PM

Ok, so I think I understand this more after looking over the Punnet square sticky again.
So to get a bird with no markings/all one color (yellow or white) you just have to choose traits/mutations that either don't show (are recessive) or are dominant over the trait that creates those markings/color.
For example, two single factor spangles together, or a recessive pied with a clearwing, etc?
Either that or breed Lutino or Albinos.
I hope I make sense, lol.

akane 05-28-2011 10:14 PM

A clearwing would have to carry recessive pied to breed with a recessive pied and make a dark eyed clear. 2 single factor or visually spangles would produce 25% double factor spangles that are clear, 50% single factor with spangle markings, and 25% plain birds with no spangle gene.

There are punnet squares for everything but yellow face on https://www.****************/colorsguide.html .

Corina 05-28-2011 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KTyne (Post 830368)
Ok, so I think I understand this more after looking over the Punnet square sticky again.
So to get a bird with no markings/all one color (yellow or white) you just have to choose traits/mutations that either don't show (are recessive) or are dominant over the trait that creates those markings/color.
For example, two single factor spangles together, or a recessive pied with a clearwing, etc?
Either that or breed Lutino or Albinos.
I hope I make sense, lol.

You made much more sense than I did :giggle:

But yes that's exactly it :D

Solid color mutations which can be either white or yellow are Dark Eyed Clears and Double Factor Spangles. Then you have Lutinos and Albinos.

KTyne 05-28-2011 10:25 PM

Ahhh, ok thanks! That make sense. :')
Can you have a bird that is both dominant or recessive pied AND spangle??
*edit- I'm guessing not since they are all genes for wing pattern/marking?


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