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Human Bird Gym
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well, my Lacewing ****, Mist is finally old enough to breed. What mutations should I breed him to to get a few Lacewing chicks?

Then Hens I have are an albino, and a skyblue dominant pied opaline (the dom. pied is too you though). I wouldn't have any problems getting another budgie hen if I needed to however.

This is a picture of him. His cinnamon markings are really faint but they're there. You can see them if you enlarge the picture or you look closely enough. Or both :p! (The red eyes don't show up in my pictures :mad: they never do. Not even on my albino...)







Sorry about the quality of this picture. It's the only picture I have that kind of shows his eyes are red.

 

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Breed him to any hen and you will get lacewing hens and cocks that are split for lacewing. Best bet is to breed him to the albino so you get albino's and lacewings only.

Your hens will be lacewings, cocks will be albino's split to lacewing.
 

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I would not let him breed with the albino! Red eye X red eye is not a good match, and the chicks will only have 75% eyesight. Also the feathers will be thinner, what makes them more vulnerable. It's not a healthy combination to breed with.
 

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Human Bird Gym
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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
Breed him to any hen and you will get lacewing hens and cocks that are split for lacewing. Best bet is to breed him to the albino so you get albino's and lacewings only.

Your hens will be lacewings, cocks will be albino's split to lacewing.
Ok, thanks a bunch :D also I have a question. If I bred him to an albino, I'd get lacewing hens and albino split lacewing cocks. What mutation would I have to breed the resulting cocks back to to get lacewings from them? Im guessing normal cinnamons? If so am I correct in assuming that the 3rd generation chicks would be both male and female lacewings?

Sorry if Im confusing. I'm trying to set up a line of lacewings :eek:
 

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I wouldn't try to breed albino animals. Despite how pretty it looks, it is still a genetic defect, resulting in weakened immune systems and other deformities. It isn't common either; to get albino animals normally requires a certain amount of inbreeding. Your albino may well have come from parents who were related in some way. There's a chance something could go wrong with the young, even if it isn't visible from first glance, so you should really consider whether you want that genetic material being passed on.
 

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Human Bird Gym
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I wouldn't try to breed albino animals. Despite how pretty it looks, it is still a genetic defect, resulting in weakened immune systems and other deformities. It isn't common either; to get albino animals normally requires a certain amount of inbreeding. Your albino may well have come from parents who were related in some way. There's a chance something could go wrong with the young, even if it isn't visible from first glance, so you should really consider whether you want that genetic material being passed on.
My albino wasn't inbred in any way whatsoever. I bred her myself. Her father was a half english that I bought from a breeder and her mother was a petstore bird. I even bought them in different cities :) Besides, I've been breeding her in the past. She's had several completely healthy clutches with my light green opaline clearflight (masking dom. pied) that I've paired her up with several times already.

Anyway, if you had read my other posts, I was also thinking about just breeding him to a normal cinnamon to get the chicks. I really don't want to pair him with my albino anyway. She's already bonded and she's getting too old to breed anyway. I also don't want her breeding anymore because she was in an accident that broke her beak which is now deformed.
 

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I would not let him breed with the albino! Red eye X red eye is not a good match, and the chicks will only have 75% eyesight. Also the feathers will be thinner, what makes them more vulnerable. It's not a healthy combination to breed with.
Completely untrue.
 

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I wouldn't try to breed albino animals. Despite how pretty it looks, it is still a genetic defect, resulting in weakened immune systems and other deformities. It isn't common either; to get albino animals normally requires a certain amount of inbreeding. Your albino may well have come from parents who were related in some way. There's a chance something could go wrong with the young, even if it isn't visible from first glance, so you should really consider whether you want that genetic material being passed on.
Albino/lutino budgies have been bred for a LONG time and no-one has ever reported health or eyesight problems any worse than a normal budgie.
 

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spɹıq ɹoɟ slɐǝɥ
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I'm really glad you said something Dean... I was thinking the very same thing but was trying to find a nice way to put it!! lol

I've never ever had any problems with my Ino's - and since I'm very partial to them, and I have more than 20 Ino's (including Nev's additions) you'd think that if there were problems - that I would have experienced them by now!!

I have Fallows, Ino's, Lacewings and never have I had any feather defects, eye sight issues - just lots of handsome and very happy little birds....

Good on you Dean for standing up for my favourite mutation 'Ino's'
 

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I could have gone on at length about genetics and scientific facts to counter the obviously flawed comments above but the simple fact about ino's is that it is not some horrid mutation inflicted on poor unsuspecting young budgies, but a simple defect in the melanin production ability. Immune, eyesight and other 'witch hunting-like' problems are hearsay and little more.
 

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Completely untrue.
No, it's not completely untrue. I agree, there are not always (visible) problems with the chicks of an red eyed combination, but that doesn't mean it is a healthy way to breed with your birds. The cockatiel is already a lot weaker (most lutino's have a spot in their neck where are no feathers, also they are smaller then the normal size of a tiel) I just don't want that to happen with budgies too.

But there are a lot of different opinions about this :)
 

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No, it's not completely untrue. I agree, there are not always (visible) problems with the chicks of an red eyed combination, but that doesn't mean it is a healthy way to breed with your birds. The cockatiel is already a lot weaker (most lutino's have a spot in their neck where are no feathers, also they are smaller then the normal size of a tiel) I just don't want that to happen with budgies too.

But there are a lot of different opinions about this :)
To say that the ino mutation in cockatiels has caused the reduction in size and the loss of neck feathers you would have to be able to establish that this was present in the first ino tiel and all tiels since. If not, then perhaps the reduction in size and loss of feathers is not due to the INO mutation, but a reduction in the gene pool through inbreeding or linebreeding ino's to ino's. Any birds that are inbred are inevitably going to face genetic weakness and illnesses unseen (or at least very rare) in more robust birds from a stronger gene pool. That the ino gene itself is solely responsible is highly unlikely.

Budgie breeders are almost as aware as canary breeders of the risks associated with breeding birds from too small a gene pool. There are also benefits, but as professional dog breeders can attest, if it is not maintained and primarily monitered for HEALTH over APPEARANCE then yes you will get problems with feather/fur, eyesight, size, bone structure etc etc.
 

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I'm a bit late answering this thread because I've been away for a couple of days. I would mate the lacewing **** to a cinnamon hen to try and strengthen the cinnamon markings. All the female chicks will be lacewing and the males will be cinnamon that are split for lacewing.

I totally agree with what Dean has said about the ino mutation. Albinos are just as robust as any other mutation. If people have trouble with them it is probably because they have birds that are inbred
 

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Human Bird Gym
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I'm a bit late answering this thread because I've been away for a couple of days. I would mate the lacewing **** to a cinnamon hen to try and strengthen the cinnamon markings. All the female chicks will be lacewing and the males will be cinnamon that are split for lacewing.

I totally agree with what Dean has said about the ino mutation. Albinos are just as robust as any other mutation. If people have trouble with them it is probably because they have birds that are inbred
Ok, thanks. I was thinking along the lines of a normal cinnamon. I will ask my parents if I can get one for my birthday (oct 7) if not then I will just buy one with my own money.

I also agree with Dean and Nev about the inos...
 

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My argument against albino animals is that because it is a rare mutation, people often do inbreed them to reproduce the gene, more than any other type of mutation. There are also several species of animal in which albinism actually does produce adverse side effects. For example, breeding for a white cat usually results in the kittens being deaf or blind. Similarly, all white tigers are born cross-eyed, and 80% of them have severe tooth and spine deformities. Albino ferrets also have been proven to have visual defects, and the list goes on...

I speak from my own experience, so if anyone has any positive experience with albinos, than I'm glad. But you should consider that for every healthy albino animal, it may have had brothers or sisters that did not survive to adulthood. Also, it IS possible that the albino animal you buy in a pet shop may have been inbred to produce the gene.
Others may disagree, and that's fine. But in my own opinion, albinism is defect. It has risks. And I'm not at all certain that I trust most breeders to avoid them.
 
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