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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Ok, so i've been looking over the genetics and I think I know how to get a lacewing.
One would need a male that is either visual to ino or cinnamon and split to the other, or split to both-
The female could be anything, and still have all female offspring be visual cin or ino (or both?) but males would also be visually effected if she is cin or ino.

So, if we add yellowface to the mix... it is dominate right?
Would a creamino female and a Cin male split to ino produce them?
Anyone have a picture of one... i'm scouring google for one right now :)

Am I totally overlooking something? lol
Thanks!
 

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I'm not the greatest at mutations

BUT i do believe the bird has to be an Albino or a lutino it can't be split to get Lace wings You pair a Albino/Lutino to a cinnamon for Lace wings

and since both Albino/Lutino and Cinnamon are all sex linked recessive and Yellow face is Dominate, I think the Yellow face would over ride any possibility of lace wings

BUT i could be wrong.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
So to get lacewings (lets say we are talking blues) I'd have to have an albino male... but since both are sex linked would it not work unless he was also split to Cin and was bred to a Cin hen... you mean he can't be split to both cin and ino right?

I have no idea about yellowface... obviously hehe
 

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The way i've understood it is it doesn't matter if the female is the albino or the cinnamon nor does it matter if the male is the albino or cinnamon But you have to have one of each
 

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Your welcome - and like i said i could be completely wrong, but thats how i understand it, from reading on them

I would love some too I've tried twice but can't seem to get the pair to do anything

first pair i set up was a Lutino male with a type 2 yellow face sky blue cinnamon female - they had eggs but the females 1st male Wouldn't leave them alone and sat at the cage screaming all day and when my lutino would climb around the cage the main male would attack him through the cage bars - then next thing i knew all the eggs were gone (not sure who ate them but they didn't get broken i know that) So i gave up on that pair and gave her back to her main man So he'd stop complaining


2nd pair were both English Budgies, Albino hen to a sky blue cinnamon male - the albino hen won't stop hanging upside from the cage roof long enough to mate -she got her name (Ariel) Because she hangs upside down all day/night only coming down long enough to eat most of the time

So after 3 months I gave up on them as well and put him with a normal green (wild type green) Opaline hen and they haven't done nothing either LOL he wants to she wants all the loving but not the mating lol
 

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Im fairly certain lacewing is not a ino bird carrying cinnamon. If you look back over the available history of the lacewing, there are arguements about two theories for its origin.

One theory is that there was a genetic cross over in a mating between ino birds CARRYING but not SHOWING any markings. Albino masks most mutations except for yellowface. However, the thought is that when the genetic crossover occured, it somehow weakened the ino gene or strengthened the cinnamon gene, allowing some faint markings of a light cinnamon colour to appear on what they dubbed the 'cinnamino'.

Another arguement is that a lacewing is neither albino or cinnamon, but a new mutation carrying phenotypical aspects of both - leading to the common confusion that it is either a crossover or a bird that is ino and also carrying cinnamon.

The only evidential data i have found but not been able to confirm is that there was a breeder who was a scientist or some such, and being curious about lacewings and believing it to be a genetic crossover (something like a 1 in 1000 chance of crossover, possibly 10,000 not sure but its rare) he proceeded to breed a large number of albino's who carried cinnamon. Apparently after a few generations, a lacewing appeared and he was then able to breed further lacewings from that bird.

There is an even vaguer and far less substantiated claim that a breeder was able to 'breed out' the wing markings in his lacewings. This has been countered with the idea that he used albino's to 'weaken' to colour, or so he thought. In actual fact he simply replaced the lacewing gene with inos, and breed out his lacewing stock, not the colour itself.

My suggestion for breeding a creamino lacewing would simply be to breed a lacewing male to a yellowface type 2 female. All your female chicks will be lacewing, and they have a 50% chance of inheriting the mothers YF2 - giving you the creamy lacewing of your dreams..

Alternatively, just get a green series lacewing... buttercup yellow with faint cinnamon markings :p
 

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Once in a blue moon I click on a mutations thread ... and yet again I am left completely bemused. My budgie is green :)
 

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Id assume you'd mate a Creamino to a Cinnamon like you would for any other Ino to a Cinnamon when producing Lacewings. You'd probably want to make sure the Creamino is split cinnamon (male) and the Cinnamon was also a YF or YF2 and (female) that way you're making sure that all chicks would be Cinnamon as well as YF or YF2 and the ones that are Ino will be Creamino Lacewings (not 100% though, Im just assuming thats how it would be done)
 

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Im fairly certain lacewing is not a ino bird carrying cinnamon. If you look back over the available history of the lacewing, there are arguements about two theories for its origin.

One theory is that there was a genetic cross over in a mating between ino birds CARRYING but not SHOWING any markings. Albino masks most mutations except for yellowface. However, the thought is that when the genetic crossover occured, it somehow weakened the ino gene or strengthened the cinnamon gene, allowing some faint markings of a light cinnamon colour to appear on what they dubbed the 'cinnamino'.

Another arguement is that a lacewing is neither albino or cinnamon, but a new mutation carrying phenotypical aspects of both - leading to the common confusion that it is either a crossover or a bird that is ino and also carrying cinnamon.

The only evidential data i have found but not been able to confirm is that there was a breeder who was a scientist or some such, and being curious about lacewings and believing it to be a genetic crossover (something like a 1 in 1000 chance of crossover, possibly 10,000 not sure but its rare) he proceeded to breed a large number of albino's who carried cinnamon. Apparently after a few generations, a lacewing appeared and he was then able to breed further lacewings from that bird.

There is an even vaguer and far less substantiated claim that a breeder was able to 'breed out' the wing markings in his lacewings. This has been countered with the idea that he used albino's to 'weaken' to colour, or so he thought. In actual fact he simply replaced the lacewing gene with inos, and breed out his lacewing stock, not the colour itself.

My suggestion for breeding a creamino lacewing would simply be to breed a lacewing male to a yellowface type 2 female. All your female chicks will be lacewing, and they have a 50% chance of inheriting the mothers YF2 - giving you the creamy lacewing of your dreams..

Alternatively, just get a green series lacewing... buttercup yellow with faint cinnamon markings :p
When the Lacewing first appeared it was believed to be a new mutation but now it is generally excepted that it is the result of combining the Ino and Cinnamon genes. There are still a few breeders that disagree. The results from pairing inos or cinnamons with lacewing quoted in the link below are exactly what would be expected from pairing a cinnamon ino with a cinnamon or an ino except that they refer to the offspring as Ino/lacewing or Cinnamon/lacewing instead of referring to them as Ino/Cinnamon or Cinnamon/Ino
http://rares.bestofbreeds.net/lacewings4.htm

Also this quote from the link below:
If we take a good look at the outcome of the matings presented it looks like the lacewing behaves if it is allelic with both cinnamon and ino at the same time but since we know these are separate genes that is quite impossible. The only plausible explanation is that the lacewing is indeed a cinnamon-ino and that leaves us to the question why the ino gene is not able to mask the cinnamon phenotype completely
http://www.euronet.nl/users/hnl/lacewing.htm

Back to the original question in this thread
Ok, so i've been looking over the genetics and I think I know how to get a lacewing.
One would need a male that is either visual to ino or cinnamon and split to the other, or split to both-
The female could be anything, and still have all female offspring be visual cin or ino (or both?) but males would also be visually effected if she is cin or ino.

So, if we add yellowface to the mix... it is dominate right?
Would a creamino female and a Cin male split to ino produce them?
Anyone have a picture of one... i'm scouring google for one right now :)

Am I totally overlooking something? lol
Thanks!
I think you are on the right track. The odds of getting a lacewing might be increased by pairing the **** that is split to both mutations with either a cinnamon or an ino. The yellow face gene can certainly be added to a blue series lacewing
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thanks so much for the replies! I think I understand now. Thanks for the lacewing link too- lots of info to look over!

On to the hard part... finding a breeder with what I'm looking for!
 

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Thanks so much for the replies! I think I understand now. Thanks for the lacewing link too- lots of info to look over!

On to the hard part... finding a breeder with what I'm looking for!
good luck hope you find what your looking for :)

Maybe we can get lucky and find what we're looking for at the same time lol

I'm trying to find a pair of Dominate pied Sky blue both split to recessive pied and at least one has to be a yellow face - - and no such luck yet lol

at least yours sounds a bit easier to locate hopefully :D
 

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When the Lacewing first appeared it was believed to be a new mutation but now it is generally excepted that it is the result of combining the Ino and Cinnamon genes. There are still a few breeders that disagree. The results from pairing inos or cinnamons with lacewing quoted in the link below are exactly what would be expected from pairing a cinnamon ino with a cinnamon or an ino except that they refer to the offspring as Ino/lacewing or Cinnamon/lacewing instead of referring to them as Ino/Cinnamon or Cinnamon/Ino
http://rares.bestofbreeds.net/lacewings4.htm

Also this quote from the link below:

http://www.euronet.nl/users/hnl/lacewing.htm

Back to the original question in this thread

I think you are on the right track. The odds of getting a lacewing might be increased by pairing the **** that is split to both mutations with either a cinnamon or an ino. The yellow face gene can certainly be added to a blue series lacewing
Thanks for the info nev. Its actually been a while since i first read up on inos and lacewings, so i was going off some fairly 'early' stage learning i must admit. Should have mentioned that :)

Regardless, thanks for your feedback as always. :)
 
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