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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi All,

I thought I'll share my recent delight and surprise at having been gifted with these new little ones!

Unfortunately my nest boxes are a bit too high for me to have captured their growth from egg until now over the past few weeks...but it's never too late!

Your advice on the babies genetics will be appreciated..some are easy, some not!...maybe some too young, but do give it a try!

Pair 1 (parents) - "Cuddles" (Hen) x "Black-Cap" (****):
Budgy0611_0070ee1.jpg

Then their young:

Budgy0611_0051e1.jpg

Budgy0611_0060e2.jpg

Budgy0611_0062e1.jpg

Budgy0611_0063e1.jpg

Chick 1 could be the "cinnamon surprise" I refered to earlier on TB, while the body colour of no 2 mistifies my mind completely!

Thanks for the help!
Enjoy Urs
jdk

PS - Oh, I almost forgot ...I seriously need names for these new ones!...any suggestions welcome (no baby ever leaves the flight for a new proud pet owner without a name!)
 

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Baby 1 - Violet Cinnamon Spangle
Baby 2- Yellow Face Grey Cinnamon Spangle
Baby 3 - Violet Opaline - Looks like a Cobalt violet to me

Since mom is Opaline dad is split baby 3 can be either male or female

It doesn't appear mom is Cinnamon so baby 1 and 2 got it from dad and they're automatically female

sorry can't help with names I have a handful of birds I still haven't named because I can't think of anything good lol
 

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Gorgeous! So colorful! :) Flower names? Fruit names? Artist names? They remind me of the tropics
 

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Chick 1 – Cinnamon spangle violet cobalt female (this means one of the parents is violet)

Chick 2 – T2 yellow face cinnamon spangle mauve male (looks grey but can't see where grey could have come from)

Chick 3 – Opaline cobalt male

Names:
Aphrodite
Apollo
Zeus
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Gorgeous! So colorful! :) Flower names? Fruit names? Artist names? They remind me of the tropics
Hi Embz,

Yes I'm glad about their colours too...I'm sure they'll be good selling and won't stay too long in the "over-crowded" Petshop ...just wished I could keep them for at least 3 or 4 months to see how their final colour turn out to be...but let's first see what the other nest's hatchlings offer?

Any subject names will be good ...if they remind you of anything memorable or enjoyable ..then that is exactly the type of names I need!

..so long the names just "stick in the listener's mind!"...

..BUT there will be more babies to come shortly..so more names will sure be needed.........(sold ~ 150 birds last year...so it gets tough for even the most creative minds!..so I know what U mean ATV...)

dont know about names but number 3 is stunning wish i lived closer i would love her
Yes, I love the Cobalt, Violet & Opaline in 1 bird...it gives such "clean, fresh and contrasting" colours and patterns!....I wish many a day that I could just "mail-a-bird" via the internet to TB members...

...cause I know you'll treasure them equally!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I moved this to mutations and genetics so you will get more responses hopefully ;)
Thanks Lindsey !

It sure helped already...I'm sure to post some more pics of these little fluffy ones...when they're a wee-bit older..

Do you also notice the "smudged dark spot" to the back of the head on babies 1 & 2 ?...(not that it's of that much significance...)

Dad had the same spot on his head, when he was younger...here's a picture of him back then!
Budgy02-2011_0098ed1.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Chick 1 - Cinnamon spangle violet cobalt female (this means one of the parents is violet)

Chick 2 - T2 yellow face cinnamon spangle mauve male (looks grey but can't see where grey could have come from)

Chick 3 - Opaline cobalt male

Names:
Aphrodite
Apollo
Zeus
Thanks a lot for the names Nev!

Aphrodite - "Greek goddess of love, beauty, and sexuality",
Apollo - "The god of music", and
Zeus - "God of the sky and ruler of the Olympian gods"
....it will be then!

I can relate to these...such names are sort of "set-in-stone" for ages to come and all to see- like the statues in historic Athens (..really enjoyed my "working/holiday"-trip there once!)

I suggest Henry The Eighth for a male bird. Gurtrude for a female bird.
Hallos Birdmanca..

..thx....but just too late for the names, but as noted above there are more babies to come under a similar "thread name" in future!

...can we agree on spelling it "Henry the 8th" for the next ****!

Thanks once again..
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 · (Edited)
...thanks for the gene answers ATv / Nev...as this is what this thread is all about!

Not that I ever doubted your opinion...as your same answers demonstrate....

..BUT..I do think the body colour of baby 2 can only be a "greyish"-shade of DF blue, i.e. mauve..(Nev's answer!).as the next 2 sets of grand-parents shows ...

....(all considering the known "uncertainty" of colony breeding of course, so gene-results given herein must be seen based on visuals of babies predominantly...albeit that in this case I think your answers also matches the expected outcomes considering the parents' visual genetic make-up)

Here's the Grand-parents (via mom "Cuddles"):
"Butterfly" (****, violet cobalt split for cinnamon; his mom is "Choc-chip"=cinnamon)
Budgy06-2010_0081e1.jpg

"Olive" (hen, DF green = olive, her mom called "Cinnamon"=cinnamon gene, but she didn't inheret such from mom!?)-
Budgy06-2010_0145e1.jpg

Here's the Grand-parents (via dad "Black-cap"):
"George" (****, guess he's cobalt blue split Opaline, as some of his hen offspring were Opaline)-
Budgy2010_0009e1.jpg

"Angel" (hen, this is where the spangle gene comes from in grand-kids!)-
Budgy09-2010_0048ed11.jpg

Thanks to all.....to be continued...
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Hi Nev / Atv / Susan / RIP / Lindsey,

Given the following "extract" from "BUDGERIGARS (Cyril Rogers) [ISBN 0 7028 1051 7]" ...I invite anyone to add his/her personalised version on subject:

The "COMBINED effects / expected outcomes from SEX-LINKED paired together" (as the Opaline & Cinnamon genes in the above hatching may demonstrate):

Quote "When two different varieties of sex-linked birds are paired together one acts as though it were a normal non-linked bird.

For instance,if a CINNAMON **** is paired to an OPALINE HEN the young will be NON-LINKED / CINNAMON OPALINE COCKS and CINNAMON HENS.

The reverse pairing of OPALINE **** to a CINNAMON HEN gives NON-LINKED / CINNAMON OPALINE COCKS and OPALINE HENS.

These sex-linked rules can be used to work out all the various matings of the 5 sex-linked varieties.
"
Unquote

Your views / expression in own words will be appreciated!

thx 4 now, jdk
 

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Given the following "extract" from "BUDGERIGARS (Cyril Rogers) [ISBN 0 7028 1051 7]" ...I invite anyone to add his/her personalised version on subject:

The "COMBINED effects / expected outcomes from SEX-LINKED paired together" (as the Opaline & Cinnamon genes in the above hatching may demonstrate):

Quote "When two different varieties of sex-linked birds are paired together one acts as though it were a normal non-linked bird.

For instance,if a CINNAMON **** is paired to an OPALINE HEN the young will be NON-LINKED / CINNAMON OPALINE COCKS and CINNAMON HENS.

The reverse pairing of OPALINE **** to a CINNAMON HEN gives NON-LINKED / CINNAMON OPALINE COCKS and OPALINE HENS.

These sex-linked rules can be used to work out all the various matings of the 5 sex-linked varieties.
"
Unquote
This is just another way of stating the same thing
 

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Hi Nev / Atv / Susan / RIP / Lindsey,

Given the following "extract" from "BUDGERIGARS (Cyril Rogers) [ISBN 0 7028 1051 7]" ...I invite anyone to add his/her personalised version on subject:

The "COMBINED effects / expected outcomes from SEX-LINKED paired together" (as the Opaline & Cinnamon genes in the above hatching may demonstrate):

Quote "When two different varieties of sex-linked birds are paired together one acts as though it were a normal non-linked bird.

For instance,if a CINNAMON **** is paired to an OPALINE HEN the young will be NON-LINKED / CINNAMON OPALINE COCKS and CINNAMON HENS.

The reverse pairing of OPALINE **** to a CINNAMON HEN gives NON-LINKED / CINNAMON OPALINE COCKS and OPALINE HENS.

These sex-linked rules can be used to work out all the various matings of the 5 sex-linked varieties.
"
Unquote

Your views / expression in own words will be appreciated!

thx 4 now, jdk
I don't think that is correct

because if you take those - and keep a male that is Split for cinnamon and Opaline and put it with a Non cinnamon and non Opaline female The only cinnamon and or Opaline (or a combo of both ) your going to get is in the Girls - so there for it is,was, and still is sex linked

a female does not pass on sex linked genes to girls only to her boys and if only mom has the sex linked gene then you get none visually

I have taken a Cinnamon Male who is split to Opaline and put with a Female who was masking Opaline and I got a Cinnamon Opaline Female - I knew it was female because of the Cinnamon - If it wasn't cinnamon then I would of had to wait til it was a bit older to know the gender

Unless I'm just misunderstanding their logic - which is possible :p
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Thanks Elsabe,

How are your birds doing...I've been too busy (at work-wish it was rather in bird flight) to "browse TB"...have U posted any new pics?

Stay well!
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Hallo Atv / Nev,

May I ask then...(now all making genetic assumptions on what is visually known from these babies’ parents alone...as the grand-and direct parents can all carry masked genes in whatever form)......

...is there thus a way (using such 2-sex linked gene- **** x -hen bird pairings) to "isolate" one of these 2 genes (again taking that each parent bird has different sex-linked gene)...in specific babies by using selective pairing-up of the parents?

Reason for asking, I really wish to keep "chick number 3 - Opaline Cobalt ('Male')"...as it really is so much better/bigger sized than the other two babies....BUT WOULD THERE BE A 100% CERTAINTY OF IT NOT CARRYING THE CINNAMON GENE?

..SO I WISH TO RETAIN THE OPALINE GENE ALONE in whatever BABY I KEEP...WHILE GETTING RID OF THE 'CINNAMON GENE'..!

Given what Nev mentioned on these babies' sexes, which I'm not so sure of (or else I still do not understand)...

...given it's more likely that the **** is visually Violet? Spangle OPALINE, with the HEN being Violet (from her dad) Opaline CINNAMON...would such parents not have "normally" given female chicks (having opaline visually) and male chicks that are "normal"/ cinnamon opaline (/opaline from dad & /cinnamon from mom)...?

...how can Opaline chick 3 then be male (if one of the 2 sex-linked genes are visual, must make it a girl – else if the Opaline comes from mom, it will be split Opaline – if indeed male)?.. while with chicks 1 & 2 having both cinnamon and opaline...how can any of the 2 chicks be other than females (visually sex-linkage shows)?...especially as only the Hen carries cinnamon, how can the cinnamon show in any male baby?

..or is it a "roll-of-the-dice" when it comes to deciding which of the 2 sex-linked genes (if shared by both parents) gets dominance over the “other”, the latter then acting as the “normal"....in gene prediction of the young?...

Nev, would there be any other reason for this sexing prediction...?

Maybe it’s best to explain step by step to us the “gene descendacy” from parent to baby (if the above parents / babies are at all such an example?) ….

…I’m now really confused!

Ah!...I'm such a slow learner!
thanks again 4 help....jacodk
 

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Hallo Atv / Nev,

May I ask then...(now all making genetic assumptions on what is visually known from these babies' parents alone...as the grand-and direct parents can all carry masked genes in whatever form)......

...is there thus a way (using such 2-sex linked gene- **** x -hen bird pairings) to "isolate" one of these 2 genes (again taking that each parent bird has different sex-linked gene)...in specific babies by using selective pairing-up of the parents?

Reason for asking, I really wish to keep "chick number 3 - Opaline Cobalt ('Male')"...as it really is so much better/bigger sized than the other two babies....BUT WOULD THERE BE A 100% CERTAINTY OF IT NOT CARRYING THE CINNAMON GENE?
Chick 3 definitely will be split for cinnamon
..SO I WISH TO RETAIN THE OPALINE GENE ALONE in whatever BABY I KEEP...WHILE GETTING RID OF THE 'CINNAMON GENE'..!

Given what Nev mentioned on these babies' sexes, which I'm not so sure of (or else I still do not understand)...
The father of these chicks must have genes for both opaline and cinnamon
...given it's more likely that the **** is visually Violet? Spangle OPALINE, with the HEN being Violet (from her dad) Opaline CINNAMON...would such parents not have "normally" given female chicks (having opaline visually) and male chicks that are "normal"/ cinnamon opaline (/opaline from dad & /cinnamon from mom)...?
The **** bird in the picture is not opaline and he doesn't appear to be cinnamon either. Bear in mind that with colony breeding he might not be the father of the chicks. If he is the father he must be split for both mutations
 
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