[KiwiBudgie]

Hi, so this is going on for about a week now, my budgie's vent area is swollen and looking a bit grey in some areas. Also the vent is extremely dirty, as the droppings cling to it and as these droppings harden on the vent, Kiwi strives hard to poop and make squeaky noises while pooping, and everytime I see her poop, I cannot see anything dropping down on the floor which means that they cling to ther bottom.
Due to all this , she strives hard to get them out of her vent area, and tries hard to remove them, and has plucked out all its white vent area feathers by constant cleaning. She removes the stuck poop when it has hardened in large clusters. Her droppings have changed their colour from light brown to dark geen since several months,but I couldnt see any behavorial changes thats why I kept silent.
She is currently eating a bit less, but is absolutely active, and even when I dont call her, she comes running towards me for treats and responds to me. But, she isnt that playful, and also I have removed most of her toys 2-3 days back which were made out of icecream sticks and shreading material, as I thought that it might have caused the pasting of vent as she might have injested some shreadded wood....
I am attaching some pics of her bottom, when pic 1, is when I first noticed the slightly swollen vent a week back(pic 1), pic 2- vent area 2 days back , pic 3,4- vent area today
I hope tgat it is not a tumor or something, and I just hope that it is merely a constipation case🥺
Additional info- She is now over 4 years of age, (her exact age is not known since she is store brought)
I have applied some oil onto her vent today morning , and her droppings are soft and a bit mushy, but it is clingy(sticky) ......

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Thanks for your reply, but based on your experience with birds, do you think that it is a tumor? or do you think that there is a high possibility that it is a tumor?

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Cody, Once again thanks for your reply. When I had applied oil to her vent, it certainly did not feel hard. Also, she had never laid eggs, even when her partner was alive , she never wanted to mate with him inspite of having the nest box.
FaeryBee, thanks for your reply too, but I am right now just a minor, who depends upon her father to take her pets to the vet, and my father has no time to take them to the vet, and even after continuously asking him, he everytime delays the vet visit wating for it to get better on her own, and only takes them to the vet when it eventually develops into a serious condition and when it is too late(I had lost the other budgie due to this)..... I know that it makes me a bad bird owner, but I had brought them when I was still younger and did not know anything about birds or their treatment, If it was not the case, then I would not have brought a budgie itself..... and so, I have come here in order to seek some help and advice.
Also I guess that it is important for you to know, that earlier in march, when her partner had died, she was called for checkup in order to make sure that she had not catched the infection, and she had a similar condition (like now) (but just for a few days), and for that she was prescribed "setliv", which was a liver tonic (avian), and "setgut" which was a probiotic , prebiotic, enzyme, powder ...for one month twice a day, but it did not help at all, and eventually after one month it stopped on its own, but this time she has a very swollen vent , that is the reason i am concerned.

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Yes, I agree with both of you, that kiwis foot looks a bit sore, it cant be called a lesion, but it has redness, and I have noticed it around 3 days before and knew that it was because of dowel perches, and have already asked my father to scrape these perches (just like they sell perches on parrotwizard) so that at each point there would be a different diameter and would be no less than a natural perch.
Thanks for all your kind advices and I will also convince him to get kiwi to the vet at the earliest within 2-3 days(as my examinations are going on) and probably he will be convinced, as he is also an animal lover , and I got to love animals because of him, the problem is just that he delays the vet visit until the budgie starts sitting on the bottom of the cage as he feels that then only treatment is needed, but we bird people know that at that point of time it is too late. Also I would like to mention that when I said that my other budgie died because of this , it was not entirely his fault as he was truely devoting all his time into visiting various vets continuously in the other budgies last 2 days, but I only meant that if he would have visited the vet in time on its first symptom(when I alerted him) and not have waited for it to get better, the budgie could have been saved(though not 100%).
I will try my best for kiwi. Thanks.

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Here is an update, two days before, I was able to take her to the vet(exotic) , and two vets checked her, and at first they suspected egg binding, but they touched the swollen area but they did not feel any hardness so they did a swab test and said that she does not have any infection or virus or bacteria so they "mostly" suspect egg binding, and when we asked about her periodical nausea since several months, she said that it might be due the egg binding.
So they applied some oily medicine onto her vent as a painkiller, and gave her two medicines, 1- a humans medicine- a pediatric steroid oral drops which is anti bacterial and anti allergic(I checked it up on google) for 4 days once a day one drop and 2- a cream named Monosol-G which is also a human medicine which contains clobetasol and gentamycin for inflammed area and for infections and told to check on her and watch changes in her droppings. I know that they were supposed to give avian meds but in India avian medicines dont exist, no matter to which vet you go, they will either give you dogs and cats medicines or humans...
Yesterday after coming from vet, I gave her the oral medicine drop and today morning I checked her- the vent area was inflammed the same as yesterday, and the poop was stuck to her vent,but there were many droppings that were on the cage floor which contained large amount of urine part, some of which also consisted of undigested or partially undigested seeds, and the more lastest 3-4 droppings were gray black .... Now I am even more scared to give her the second dose, if it has happened due to the medicine......
I have yet not applied the cream , because I remember an incident few years back when I was uneducated about birds and I had applied some cream named "cosvateG " on her feet for scalliness and she had polyuria and we had to rush to the vet..... and now that I have looked it up on google that the new medicine given by the vet yesterday, has the same to same medicinal ingredients, I am now even more hesitant and scared to apply it to her vent as the area is easily accessible to her and she can ingest it......
Now I dont really know what to do,
Also I had asked the vet about her scaly feet, and she said that she has mites which is also causing the redness, and she sprayed sone strong smelling herbal spray on her neck(dont know if it was avian o some dogs or cats spray) and she immediately preened it , so i guess she ingested some of it.... so I am confused as to weather the gray-black poop was caused due to the medicine drops or the mites spray or anything else.....

 

[KiwiBudgie]

#2 Update: So day before yesterday, it was time for her second dose of omnicortil drop, and faerybee had not posted the reply then, so I had given the dose, after which she started having dark black poops(indicating digested blood), the whole day, became listless , fluffed up, inactive and started vomiting and had nausea the whole day, then we again went to the same vet for followup and she seemed to be clueless about what was hapenning with kiwi and directed us to avian vets outside my city as she said that she would not recommended any avian vet from my city, but those are too far away for travelling with kiwi and also they have bad bird reviews on google, then I read your reply and consulted an online vet but from India where they say that even expert avian vets are available,( We did not consult vets from international cuz they give vague diagnosis and will give avian meds that wouldnot be available here). So we described our issue to the vet, and he said that kiwi had a allergy to the omnacortil drop, and he asked us to immediately stop the medicines and prescribed (all human medicines as I have already said that avian meds dont exist here) a oflox oz syrup ( 1 drop diluted in 2.5 ml of water, twice a day for 5 days), liver tonic and Vizylac powder once a day( lactobacillus ) and a gel named neosporin to apply onto her slightly reduced swollen area thrice a day for 5 days. He asked us to come online for for follow up on 7th sept. He stated under the tentative diagnosis column- " Gastro Entritis" He also mentioned under the recommendation column," management improvement required" . Can you guys please explain what did he meant by management improvement? and what I should do to improve it.....
I am feeling so bad to see her all fluffed up, sitting with a sad face in one corner who used to be so happy ,slim and playful till before yesterday😞

 

[KiwiBudgie]

I forgot to mention that since morning the black poops have stopped but the poops have become dihorrea-like with more urine content, dark green feces and yellow urates- indicating that she is not eating enough, but in reality she is eating moderately but the fact is that she is vomiting most of it( I fear if all of it) which is making the urates yellow

 

[KiwiBudgie]

I know that yellow urates indicates liver disease, but from my experience it also means absolute no food intake , because when my other budgie had died, he was having same poops with dark green feces, and yellow urates when was not eating at all and have told it to vet also, but he still did not say anything about liver disease. Right now she is vomiting so much, she is vomiting each and every seed she is eating, nothing is getting digested, her whole face is stained with vomit, which also means that whatever medicines she is on, will also be useless as it is also getting vomited. How will she survive if no food gets digested!! I am getting panicked, and losing hope as I am writing this😥 I dont want to lose her, I love her and she wants to live I can see that in her eyes .All this happened because of that ridiculous omnacortil medicine prescribed by that pathetic vet😡 Everything was going fine before going to that vet. This is my biggest regret, I wish I could reverse it🥺

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Another sad update, Kiwi has stopped eating alltogether and the meds dont seem to be working on her and is getting weaker and weaker. But I gave her some cilantro( her favourite) so that she could get atleast some enery through it. Tried to contact the online vet through his assistant but the assistant is not picking up call.
Should I try giving her electolyte solution? and what else should I do to increase her energy level?

 

[KiwiBudgie]

You can give her an electrolyte solution called Pedialyte if you can get that. Have you looked at the info in this link that pertains to India Locating an Avian Vet//On-Line Avian Veterinarian Help

Yes, I had gone through the link and had also looked it up on google. But the fact is there are avain vets in my city but they mostly treat cats and dogs as still their main clients are cat and dog owners, and according to the reviews about hem on google, there are very few bird related reviews and if there are any, they are so bad(about the vet killing their bird due to wrong meds, or the bird getting seriously ill etc) that you will be scared to take your bird to such vets. And I found this online vet much more experienced as he could quickly tell what was hapenning with her whereas that pathetic vet kept on speaking about egg binding........

I feel like you did everything right and had Kiwi's best interests at heart, but your country - like mine - lack professional avian vets. I've had them prescribe me bogus medication before, and I've seen other birds slowly dying and the owners say the same as you "the vet gave me medicine and it made them worse". I wish these horrible vets would have the decency to say when they're out of their depth and don't know how to help instead of prescribing stuff that makes our birds worse.

All the best for Kiwi, I hope they make a full recovery.

Thanks @ChickWas for the much needed support. Now lets hope for the best and see what the online vet says to do about her lack of appetite....

Also there is a good as well as a bad update, it looks like since afternoon her nausea is reduced and she seems to more active as compared to in the morning when she used to sleep the whole day and also investigated her toy...... But the bad update is that still her droppings are dihorrea-like and still very fluffed up and there are two things to be concerned about which I am going to ask it to the vet tomorrow morning in the scheduled online apointment- 1. she is going every now and then to her seed bowl , but just pretends to eat, just nibbles them and throws them out of the bowl
2. Pic below. I saw that the dark color of the skin on her vent has darkened even more, it is more dark black now

 

[KiwiBudgie]

That does not look good, the dark color may be blood under the skin or some sort of bruise, can you clean the droppings off of the area?

Yes when I apply the ointment I try to clean as much I can but it gets gets covered in droppings in no time...

Can you share a picture of her whole cage setup? Please share these pictures with the online vet as they may be able to tell what it is. Whatever it is, it looks extremely sore and painful for poor Kiwi. I've never seen such a large patch of feathers bare before, when my Wasabi had diarrhea and a bacterial infection, she only removed the feathers directly surrounding her vent, not all the way to the base of her tail and up her stomach.

In India, you might have some luck going to a bird pharmacy, there will be a few for pigeons mainly. The workers there might be able to know what's wrong if you show them the pictures. But again, they might just prescribe you stuff that isn't going to help. Always google the medication before administering it to the bird if it comes from an untrained source (the online vets you can trust, but local vets and pigeon shop workers you cannot).

Yes, I agree a large patch of feathers is missing and it looks terrible.Also there is no bird pharmacy as such in my entire city(I googled it) but there is on general pet pharmacy which I know is mainly for cats and dogs and has only a few bird supplements and seels the medicines only on presciption.....

Today morning I talked with the online vet before which, her droppings had again become black, so I told the vet that she has stopped eating and told that I had given her cilantro, so he told that I must give her cooked rice paste and stop giving any greens as it will cause even more diherria and will not help so I told him that I give her meds only through the cilantro stem(it is most convinient way, not at all stressful for her ) and she will not drink the meds without it. so he said that we must give her the most easily digestible food hence that rice paste and said that In this case I should keep the cilantro limited to giving meds and said that if she is not at all taking the paste then in such extreme case I can give her the greens. He said that I should try not to force meds or the paste into her mouth as it can go into her lungs and can cause respiratory illness. He said that the start of black stools again, means still there is strong infection but also said that the reduction in vomition can mean that the meds are working..... he also said that we should maintain her energy level at any cost as keeping her on saline may not be the appropriate option for such a small bird.I also told him about the darkened skin on vent and asked him to check the pics of her vent that I has attached on the consult info page on the app but he did not say anything about it..... He adviced us to keep giving the already prescribed meds and continue for 7 days if required instead of 5. He said that the most important thing is to get the diherria and the infection in control through the meds. He also added that sometimes egg laying birds encounter various fatal infections and the egg can break inside and can become septic.... (why did say this?she isnt an egg laying bird!?) I asked him wether he can prescribe any anti vomiting drug if she starts vomiting, then he said that they do not give such medicine to birds, it is only for other animals......

Another important to note, that just a while ago when I was applying the ointment to her swollen vent, it felt so warm to touch, like almost hot.... what does that mean!?

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Thanks for your reply Cody😊

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Just now when I was giving her medicine, for some reason she turned upside down when I could properly see her swollen vent and it looked like an egg inside her(maybe broken) so I visited this site on google- Egg Binding in Pet Birds – Beauty of Birds.
which I found helpful, and the symptoms of a bird being egg bound/ or egg broken stated in this site exactly matched with Kiwis symptoms and this site says that this condition is life threatning. It also means that the vet whom I was blaming for giving wrong meds was actually correct(but not 100% as she had infection too). Now I am almost sure that along with infection she also is egg bound, as the online vet(best avian vet) also said similar and more exact thing that is stated in this site.....
So now I am more concerned about how the egg will pass out, or if broken then how will it come out, and moreover even if the infection gets cured will the egg pass out on its own or if not then will the vet prescribe any meds that will make the egg pass out, or will massage and remove it manually, or if only surgery or something will only be required!?😓

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Have you contacted an on-line Avian Veterinarian as I advised in my previous post on this thread?
You really need to get professional help for Kiwi. She is obviously in pain and is suffering. This is not fair to her.

Yes, we did contact an online avian vet (who is from India) on wagr app which is an Indian app which provides for expert vet consultation (both avian expert vets and experts for dogs and cats as well) via video call and I have posted what the online vet said, and what medications he gave in my latest posts.... And according me I think he is the best avian vet in whole of India as he could instantly determine what was going on with her....
I agree that she is in pain, and suffering but we will have to wait until the course of medicines is over to check the results in her improvement......

Update: She has started to improve bit by bit.... and since 4th of sept till today, there is no digested blood in her poop, i.e they are not black now, but they are still dark green, and now the urates are also white, but the urine portion is still large, but at the same time they are not diherria-like, the feces are more well formed and firm now and she has started eating (but started having nausea and vomiting as soon as she started eating again) also she is not eating that rice paste......
Just before some time, I had again constulted the same online vet, so we could ask him about the possibility of an egg/ broken egg inside her so we could take her to avian vet outside our city, for extraction, but he clearly said that there is no possibility of an egg inside her and we must not worry about any kind of egg or broken egg since the birds who have an egg inside dont survive for long and they die within a few hours or in a day or two, and he said that if it was egg binding then Kiwi would not have survived..... He asked us to continue the same meds and apply the same ointment to her vent for two more days and when I told him about her nauseating again after eating seeds, then he said to let her eat how much ever she wants.....
Now I am relieved that it is not related to egg... and also that she is a bit more active now and I found her beak grinding today afternoon before her nap😁

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Since the vet confirmed that is not an egg inside, I now suspect possible liver disease or liver enlargement as I read the symptoms on the internet and they too are similar to kiwis symptoms execpt that she has white urates and not green or yellow. I would be asking about this to the online vet in next followup.
If there is any link or any thread related to the symptoms and treatment of liver disease please post it here as it would be of much help to me.....

Also yesterday was the last day of her 'Oflox Oz syrup' and today will be the last day for the neosporin ointment application. Also, 3-4 days back I had told in my post that her abdominal swollen area felt hot, but the following day and till two days after it only felt a bit warm and not hot..., but now since yesterday again it feels hot to touch. Which means the infection is still there?
Another thing I wanted to ask, that while I was applying that ointment to her abdomen, I was only concerned about its application to the area, I did not just bother about the nearby feathers that were also becoming sticky..... and today I just realised that all the nearby feathers were completely sticky, greasy and stuck together and she was tring hard to clean it off and with the same beak with which she tried to clean those feathers, she preened the rest of her feathers too, and now they too appear oily and sticky....
How to I clean it off!? I cannot get rid of it just by a tissue or water, because after applying the ointment, my fingers become so greasy that I have to wash my hands atleast three times with soap until I get rid of it completely..... Since we cannot use soap on birds, how do I clean it off!?

Also I found out something terrible, while she was preening, I saw that all the feathers below her wings were missing, I could see her limbs upto the joint on her body!!!!!(But I could not see any feather around the cage since a month/ or maybe that ointment grease went up to those feathers?) This may be because of mites, and it also means that the strong smelling spray which that exotic vet sprayed on her neck for mites, did not help at all.....
She is so much in pain! Cant see her like this, I want her recovery as fast as possible!😭

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Forgot to update: Before 2 days, when the whole medicines course was completed I again took one followup with the online vet, I told him everything about her and improvements, and also shared my screen and properly showed him the pics of her abdomen and the blisters-like thing on it, zoomed those pics in and out and made well sure that he had seen it clearly.....
Though he did not say anything about her condition( i dont know why,) he suggested me to give the vizylac and liver tonic for one more week and start the application of neosporin ointment again.... He also prescribed one syrup named vimeral(avian supplement) which is a multivitamin syrup and a stress reliever which is commonly used in poultry birds.I am still wondering what would have caused such a sore lump.......☹

 

[KiwiBudgie]

Today Kiwis energy level seemed to be too low, so now we have decided to take her to the nearby avian vet( hope he would not prescribe any wrong meds) tomorrow(as today being a sunday, all vet clinics are closed) as we would be taking the last chance available... I was initially scared to take her to such "not so good avian vet" with bad reviews, but since she is getting weaker and weaker, it is the only option left with us.... as taking a risk would be better than not at all trying...... and also because even if the online vet was excellent, there was very little scope for accurate diagnosis of the swollen lump in virtual( anyways I am thankful to him for atleast saving my bird from dying due to wrong meds).....
Now I only hope that the vet should correctly diagnose her condition, and prescribe correct meds and dosage unlike what the first exotic vet did to her)
Also I would like to ask in advance, that if at all the vet to which we are planning to go, asks us to do x ray, should we allow it? because she is already very sick and out of energy and the illness is already increasing her stress levels, and I have also heard many birds dying due to heart attack during x rays and some not coming out of the anesthesia.....
Another thing, the multivitamin supplement( which has all kinds of vitamins) prescribed by the vet is not helping her gain strength, she likes it and drinks it properly, still she is getting weaker....... is there any another way by which i can increase her energy level?
PS: she has gone extremely underweight from some what overweight, as I could sharply feel the keel bone sticking out....and pedialyte electrolyte soln. is not available here...

 

[KiwiBudgie]

REST IN PEACE KIWI😭💔

It is afternoon right now, just an hour ago I saw her peacefully sleeping inside her next box, I did not disturb her and went inside my room to study..... but just a while ago when I got up to check on her and give her the next dose of multivitamins and ointment, she was laying still and cold with her eyes open and with curled legs on the bottom of her cage in a terrible way. It was no doubt appearing to be dead, but I still my mind was not ready to accept the reality, I still hoped that she was alive and made noises to wake her up, but she had already left the world forever...... I could not hold my tears when she was taken out of her cage for burying......
She was a happy and a curious budgie, who used to love greens and who was playful who loved her toys and would have no one touch her toys......She lived her life happily and enjoyed every moment in her life..... Such a nice budgie!!
Now my house is left budgieless, now it is cold and silent, no chirps, no singing, no sounds of their presence, it is all deathly silent forever!!! I remember the times when my house was filled with chirps of joy and her partner blueberry my handsome budgie all day chattering away...... Till today since the time I owned budgies no day was silent, even today she was chirping at me a few hours ago.......
Fly high Now they both my Blueberry and Kiwi are united together in heaven
Goodbye Kiwi💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💔💛💚💛💚🤍💙🤍💙