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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So I've spent the last few hours reading articles from the Budgerigar Association Of America

and I came across an Article on Violets- Of course this being one of my TOP favorite Mutations - I had to stop and read it -
and now i'm confused- not so much about the violet mutation though

but it states Since Violet is Dominant It can't be Masked..

It is not my intent to hold a genetics class, however a little genetic information is needed to
understand the violet factor. The violet factor is a dominant factor. As a dominant factor, violet cannot be masked
so with that said - Is that just for Color Adding factors or is that for Dominant genes in general?

meaning does that mean ANY dominant Gene Such as Dominant Pied can't be masked?

I thought All mutations could be masked at least on the Ino mutations and DF Spangles (and maybe Dark eye clear - never really hear any one say anything about that one masking mutations lol)

but Some other things I learned - was how to tell if your budgie is a violet....

The violet skyblues color ranges from a very well colored sky to a normal cobalt. The telling
factor is the main tail feathers. The violets tend to have a turquoise edging on the tail feathers. Birds
with a violet factor tend to have a glossier turquoise iridescence when viewed under florescent lighting
I will defiantly be paying closer attention to the tail feathers of my Violets :)

but here's the article I am reading -there is a part 2 as well but I haven't gotten there yet
http://www.budgerigarassociation.org/Articles/Violet Budgies.pdf

and the Main page not sure if you can get back to it from the Article or not

http://www.budgerigarassociation.org/articles.htm

My brain is just filled with all kinds of new stuff tonight :)
 

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Very interesting! I never paid much attention. Lasso is a violet and I wondered why his tail looked turquoise. Thanks! That stuff is good to learn especially since I hope to one day breed him and a special budgie once. :)

 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Bad part is I was looking something entirely different up LOL but by the time I got done reading everything on that website I forgot what i was looking up to start with So i didn't get my answer I started out my night seeking but that's okay I learned more stuff along the way :D
 

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All of this is still too much for me to grasp, but it is interesting. Where do one get the second part - can't find it. (BTW what where you looking for in the first pace? Maybe the frosted pied of Jo Ann?- There's a photo of that bird as their profile pic)
 

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So you are asking if all dominant mutations can be masked? All mutations can be masked by some mutations, such as albino, lutino. For example an albino budgie can also be dominant pied. But you can't see it because albino masking the dominant pied.

On the other hand have you can't have a budgie that is split for dominant pied. A bird either shows a dominant mutation or is masking one. A budgie can not be split for dominant mutations. It can't happen. Budgies can be split for recessive and sexlinked mutations, such as recessive pied and opaline.

I hope that helps.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
All of this is still too much for me to grasp, but it is interesting. Where do one get the second part - can't find it. (BTW what where you looking for in the first pace? Maybe the frosted pied of Jo Ann?- There's a photo of that bird as their profile pic)
here's the 2nd part
http://www.budgerigarassociation.org/Articles/Violet Budgies2.pdf

I think i was looking up more information on Yellow faces and how it works - Looking up info on Frosted Pied is my next adventure though lol

So you are asking if all dominant mutations can be masked? All mutations can be masked by some mutations, such as albino, lutino. For example an albino budgie can also be dominant pied. But you can't see it because albino masking the dominant pied.

On the other hand have you can't have a budgie that is split for dominant pied. A bird either shows a dominant mutation or is masking one. A budgie can not be split for dominant mutations. It can't happen. Budgies can be split for recessive and sexlinked mutations, such as recessive pied and opaline.

I hope that helps.
No I know all that- But Violet is Dominant and can NOT be masked - as the article states- So that made me thinking If Violet is Dominant and can't be masked.. then can any Dominant Gene Really be masked after all.

And they said That the violet can't be masked because it is Dominant - - So is it Just Violet that can't be masked? and if so why is it Just a certain Dominant Gene can't be masked but the rest can be?

That's the part that got me confused.

I would think All Dominant Genes would work in the same Manner when it came to being masked. If one can be masked then they all could be. If one couldn't then none could.

Hopefully that makes more sense now
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Your welcome.. I know it's amazing what I find when I search for something totally different - maybe if I'd search for these things I'd find what I'm actually looking for :giggle:

But then again it doesn't help much that I get side tracked and get into something and forget to go back to finish my 1st search I started lol - I may find things better if I could just stay on track :laughing:
 

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I don't know if I understand this correctly: Is there then a difference in colour between an albino and an albino "masking" violet?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I don't know if I understand this correctly: Is there then a difference in colour between an albino and an albino "masking" violet?
I'm not sure - I don't think I've ever had one But from what I read if a Albino is masking violet then it has a violet sheen to it instead of the normal blue sheen they have , and if they're masking grey then it's a Grey sheen instead of blue - But I've never seen any Albino with a violet or Grey sheen only the normal Blue you get in certain lights or with the flash

But according to this Violet can't be masked, So I'm not sure how you'd tell a Violet Albino from a Albino w/out the Violet. Or if you could tell with out breeding to a non violet.

And I would think if Violet can't be masked then Grey couldn't be either because Grey is a dominant Color Adding Factor and Violet is a Semi Dominant Color Adding factor.
 

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I'm not sure - I don't think I've ever had one But from what I read if a Albino is masking violet then it has a violet sheen to it instead of the normal blue sheen they have , and if they're masking grey then it's a Grey sheen instead of blue - But I've never seen any Albino with a violet or Grey sheen only the normal Blue you get in certain lights or with the flash

But according to this Violet can't be masked, So I'm not sure how you'd tell a Violet Albino from a Albino w/out the Violet. Or if you could tell with out breeding to a non violet.

And I would think if Violet can't be masked then Grey couldn't be either because Grey is a dominant Color Adding Factor and Violet is a Semi Dominant Color Adding factor.
Will you be so kind to explain Dominant colour and semi Dominant colour Adding factors?

Colour me confused :p
Don't worry, you're not the only one:S
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Will you be so kind to explain Dominant colour and semi Dominant colour Adding factors?

Don't worry, you're not the only one:S
it's not any different than any other dominant or semi dominant mutation ;) I just added the "color factor" part so people would know I was talking about the Color adding factors of violet and Grey - since Violet and grey aren't actually "mutations" on their own they're both color adding Factors - but it would be the same as any mutation. Grey is Dominant so for an Example - one parent is Grey one Parent is Sky blue - the babies will be Grey (of course its technically called Grey blue) .

With violet its semi Dominant - so one parent is Violet one parent isn't (still referring to blue series) You'll get some Violet Blue babies some that don't have the Violet at all

Make sense? :D
 

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it's not any different than any other dominant or semi dominant mutation ;) I just added the "color factor" part so people would know I was talking about the Color adding factors of violet and Grey - since Violet and grey aren't actually "mutations" on their own they're both color adding Factors - but it would be the same as any mutation. Grey is Dominant so for an Example - one parent is Grey one Parent is Sky blue - the babies will be Grey (of course its technically called Grey blue) .

With violet its semi Dominant - so one parent is Violet one parent isn't (still referring to blue series) You'll get some Violet Blue babies some that don't have the Violet at all

Make sense? :D
Now I totally lost. Do you say that when you pair a grey with a sky blue all the babies will be grey? I don't agree. I have such a pairing and I got some sky blues from them. Doesn;t semi dominant means that the colour (violet) goes with the original colour? Example : sky with violet, cobalt with violet, ect. Where you don't get that with grey - it is grey and sky with grey ect. ????

Sorry for being stupid tonight - I 've been marking exam papers and assessment task for the past 4 days and I'm quite tired by now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Now I totally lost. Do you say that when you pair a grey with a sky blue all the babies will be grey? I don't agree. I have such a pairing and I got some sky blues from them. Doesn;t semi dominant means that the colour (violet) goes with the original colour? Example : sky with violet, cobalt with violet, ect. Where you don't get that with grey - it is grey and sky with grey ect. ????

Sorry for being stupid tonight - I 've been marking exam papers and assessment task for the past 4 days and I'm quite tired by now.
Every time I've ever put a Grey Budgie to a non Grey Budgie. I've gotten All Grey babies

When I put 1 Violet Budgie to a Non Violet Budgie I only get some violet budgies - and the Blue depends on if he parents had dark factors or not - but yes its Sky violet, Cobalt Violet(only True Violet there is), Mauve Violet

not sure if these will help or confuse you more though
Genetics of Violet Factor
http://www.***************/gen_violet.html

Genetics of Grey Factor
http://www.***************/gen_grey.html
 

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I've read those pieces before and there they say that if you pair a SF grey with a normal you will 50% greys and 50% normals. When you use DF grey all the babies will be grey.
 
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