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Go Back   Talk Budgies Forums > Budgie Talk > Your Budgie's Health


Your Budgie's Health Learn about avian health and vet care. This forum does not substitute for veterinary expertise.

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  #1  
Old 09-29-2016, 05:52 PM
Crunchkin (Yana)
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Default What is going on? Please help

Hello Talk Budgies,

Sorry that this is long but I want to make sure that everything that's happened is here. Please help...

My female flock of 2 (Kiwi 10 yrs & Nacho 6 yrs) are going through some illness...I never had any problems until a few months ago. I started buying seed mix from a local bird store I discovered, which was right around the time all the trouble began. This bag of seed mix had two maggots in it, that I only discovered after giving the food to my girls for a couple of weeks. I threw out the bag but couple of weeks later, I noticed that Kiwi was making clicking sounds when breathing, her vent was swollen and she was fluffed up a lot. Now let me say that this girl has never been sick, she outlived 2 other birds and I never had any issues with her.

As soon as I heard that clicking, I took both girls to the emergency vet. Kiwi was diagnosed with a bacterial infection and vet prescribed Clavamox. Nacho seemed fine except for a lump near her vent (she's a big girl that likes to eat) that has been there for a couple of years but the vet said to have it checked out by another vet that only sees birds. Few weeks go by, Kiwi is doing well after her rounds of Clavamox and back to her normal self. Then Nacho starts to vomit occasionally, like every two weeks, but she recovers well each time and goes back to her normal self. Then Kiwi had a vomiting accident once, which she also recovered from quickly. Meanwhile, I still went back to that bird store to get different food thinking it was just that one bag.

Eventually Nacho's vomiting got pretty bad. Poor thing couldn't eat or poop anything. I took Nacho to the avian vet that emergency vet recommended. Avian vet analyzed her crop, droppings and found a Staph infection in droppings, plus she lost a little weight but nothing too alarming since I changed their diet to pellets, frantically thinking its the seed diet that's making Nacho sick. Avian vet prescribed Enrofloxacin antibiotic (Baytril) and Meloxicam anti-inflammatory. We started meds but a couple of days later when Nacho started feeling better and eating again, she vomited and didn't poop for about 24 hours. I took her back to the avian vet, they did an x-ray and found that her liver is a bit larger than normal, plus she lost even more weight, from 51g to 34g. Avian vet recommended a very strict pellet diet with veggies and to encourage foraging. Nacho stopped vomiting and started pooping normal again but she's still really fluffed all the time and now I'm noticing that Kiwi is fluffed all the time too, it's not normal for her. I also noticed that they both eat like the world is ending and can't stop eating so I have to limit their portions.

Is this really caused by Staph or is something else going on? I just read about Canker (Trichomoniasis) and it kind of sounds like it. Avian vet didn't mention Canker and we're kind of taking it slow trying to figure out what's causing all this? Anyone have experience with it? Do you think that's what they might have? Is it treatable and what is the treatment? What should I do? I don't want to lose my girls.

I did throw out all the food I ever bought from that bird store and started ordering food online straight from the source. Never ever going there again. Even vet's tech said their food looks sketchy. I wish I knew and could prevent it all...

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  #2  
Old 09-29-2016, 06:47 PM
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Yana,

I'm very sorry to hear Kiwi and Nacho are both having such problems.

Has your Avian Vet tested both birds for AGY?
If not - I would have that done immediately.

https://talkbudgies.com/articles-budg...dgerigars.html

https://talkbudgies.com/articles-budg...ric-yeast.html

I'm wishing all the best for your little girls and will be looking forward to your update.

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Old 09-29-2016, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by FaeryBee View Post

Yana,

I'm very sorry to hear Kiwi and Nacho are both having such problems.

Has your Avian Vet tested both birds for AGY?
If not - I would have that done immediately.

https://talkbudgies.com/articles-budg...dgerigars.html

https://talkbudgies.com/articles-budg...ric-yeast.html

I'm wishing all the best for your little girls and will be looking forward to your update.


Yes, she said that would be the next step if antibiotic doesn't work. Thank you so much for your suggestion! Will get that done asap.
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Old 09-30-2016, 02:18 AM
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Hi Yana, definitely get the crop swab and faecal test done as soon as possible for AGY.
Get some probiotics give these to both budgies in the food mix .
Make sure they are kept extra warm, clean perches, cage and dishes extremely well. With the dramatic weight loss, I would actually be offering egg and biscuit mix to help keep some condition on them if possible. I have an AGY budgie he is living completely normal and is interactive with the other two birds I have.
Please let us know how the Avian vet visit goes
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Old 09-30-2016, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Pretty boy View Post
Hi Yana, definitely get the crop swab and faecal test done as soon as possible for AGY.
Get some probiotics give these to both budgies in the food mix .
Make sure they are kept extra warm, clean perches, cage and dishes extremely well. With the dramatic weight loss, I would actually be offering egg and biscuit mix to help keep some condition on them if possible. I have an AGY budgie he is living completely normal and is interactive with the other two birds I have.
Please let us know how the Avian vet visit goes
The vet is waiting on test results from lab but I'm pretty sure it's AGY because Nacho had it when I first got her and with diet changes I think it triggered but now she gave it to Kiwi. Thank you for your suggestions! I'm cleaning perches every day and their dishes between meals. What kind of probiotic is safe for them? And can you recommend a good biscuit mix?

Also, is it ok to put a little apple cider vinegar in their water in addition to probiotic or only do one or the other? Any other foods ok to help them fight it?

Thank you!

Well I just spoke to the vet and fecal results came back negative for AGY. I don't know what else to do here...

Nacho had psittacosis when I first got her, not AGY. For some reason I thought it was the same thing. Can psittacosis come back?

Last edited by FaeryBee; 09-30-2016 at 08:55 PM. Reason: MERGED POSTS
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Old 09-30-2016, 08:53 PM
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Yana,

AGY and psittacosis are not the same thing. Yes, psittacosis can be contracted more than once by a bird.

Sometimes fecal samples come back negative for AGY but the budgie actually has it and it doesn't show except during a necropsy.

Please read the article which is linked in the thread below:

https://talkbudgies.com/articles-budg...ric-yeast.html

I would suggest starting them on a course of Sodium Benzoate. I use Sodium Benzoate for all of my birds for a 30 day period about 3 times per year.

You can buy the product on-line through Amazon.com
This link shows the one I use: Sodium Benzoate

I start with about 1/8 tsp of Sodium Benzoate per 8 oz of water. Then after a week, increase the amount a little until you are up to 1/4 tsp per 8 oz. of water. I mix it fresh each time I change the water.

I do not use ACV when I'm using the Sodium Benzoate. After the 30 day period, you can give the budgies a rest from the treatment and use ACV in their water at that time.

With regard to pro-biotics, the one I use is Avi-Bios
https://www.amazon.com/Avitech-BIOS2...0081RYWTY?th=1
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Old 09-30-2016, 10:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FaeryBee View Post
Yana,

AGY and psittacosis are not the same thing. Yes, psittacosis can be contracted more than once by a bird.

Sometimes fecal samples come back negative for AGY but the budgie actually has it and it doesn't show except during a necropsy.

Please read the article which is linked in the thread below:

https://talkbudgies.com/articles-budg...ric-yeast.html

I would suggest starting them on a course of Sodium Benzoate. I use Sodium Benzoate for all of my birds for a 30 day period about 3 times per year.

You can buy the product on-line through Amazon.com
This link shows the one I use: Sodium Benzoate

I start with about 1/8 tsp of Sodium Benzoate per 8 oz of water. Then after a week, increase the amount a little until you are up to 1/4 tsp per 8 oz. of water. I mix it fresh each time I change the water.

I do not use ACV when I'm using the Sodium Benzoate. After the 30 day period, you can give the budgies a rest from the treatment and use ACV in their water at that time.

With regard to pro-biotics, the one I use is Avi-Bios
https://www.amazon.com/Avitech-BIOS2...0081RYWTY?th=1
Thank you again Deborah! Just ordered Sodium Benzoate and probiotic. Do you think I should continue with antibiotic? I stopped giving it last night because I feel like it's not doing anything but contributing to the illness due to stress. Second guessing everything now...
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Old 09-30-2016, 11:16 PM
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I can imagine the stress you are experiencing, As Deborah stated AGY often does not show up , did they do a crop wash as well as a fecal sample?
AGY also is more prominent when the weather is humid, stress will also bring it on. Do your budgies look like they are trying to adjust the crop more often? What is the vent area like, wet and no feathers?
I use Vetafarm PolyAid Probiotics I simply sprinkle the powder onto the seed mix.
Egg and Biscuit mix can be bought commercially or you can make your own.
https://talkbudgies.com/recipes-budgi...step-step.html
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Old 10-01-2016, 09:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Crunchkin View Post
Thank you again Deborah! Just ordered Sodium Benzoate and probiotic. Do you think I should continue with antibiotic? I stopped giving it last night because I feel like it's not doing anything but contributing to the illness due to stress. Second guessing everything now...
Could you tell me which antibiotic was prescribed?
Amphoteracin B is generally the treatment of choice for budgies suspected of having AGY (in conjunction with the Sodium Benzoate)
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Old 10-02-2016, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pretty boy View Post
I can imagine the stress you are experiencing, As Deborah stated AGY often does not show up , did they do a crop wash as well as a fecal sample?
AGY also is more prominent when the weather is humid, stress will also bring it on. Do your budgies look like they are trying to adjust the crop more often? What is the vent area like, wet and no feathers?
I use Vetafarm PolyAid Probiotics I simply sprinkle the powder onto the seed mix.
Egg and Biscuit mix can be bought commercially or you can make your own.
https://talkbudgies.com/recipes-budgi...step-step.html
Vet did a crop lavage and it only showed a Staph infection. Their symptoms and unusual behaviors I noticed:
-eating all day, more than usual
-if not eating, sleeping or looking for more food
-fluffed all the time, cold to the touch feet
-droppings look normal but bigger in size and more often (both of their droppings look the same, usually their droppings look different from the others)
-occasionally wet droppings, sometimes get stuck to the vent, feathers around vent are wet
-not chirping
-not playing
-Nacho's beak is starting to look longer than usual
-Kiwi was moulting a week ago or losing feathers and then it stopped, but I'm not seeing new feathers yet

Thank you!
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